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CA Automotive UK
23-06-2007, 03:00 PM
As many of you know I tend to get on my soapbox about all the misinformation on re mapping that seems to exist today, some examples being claims such as :

- 35 bhp for an E46 M3 ( "because we can map the vanos to act like high lift cams" say some chip tuners !!! Yeah right ! Vanos controls cam overlap ONLY, and yes you can adjust it to give various effects, but + 20 bhp over all other tuners' remaps is not one of them :)
- "invisible" coded maps :confused: :confused:
- full "live mapping" through the car's OBD port and a run down the road. Not possible... for many reasons,not least of which is the data transfer rate from an OBD port could never support this kind of action.
- dyno results achieved on the chip tuners own dyno

Over the past three years we have learnt a lot about maping, and been lucky enough to meet and be able to employ when required one of the top three engineers in the world. Sounds like a boast I know, but as an example this software engineer (MR X as we call him) has just finished mapping the latest Mclaren Formula 1 racing car, originated the OEM BMW maps for the new M3, the E60 M5, and a lot more. So no boasting here :)

Well these last two days we have spent at Bruntingthorpe carrying out true "Live Mapping " on our M3 and 3 customer cars.

The ONLY way to live map is to solder special sockets inside the DME board and connect an emulator between the DME and laptop, and a good AFR gauge to the exhaust.

In basic terms the emulator ( at a cost of many thousands of pounds)replicates what the DME is doing, in real time onto our laptop whilst we are driving, allowing us to accurately monitor AND adjust all parameters ( fuel, ign., vanos control, safety fields, temp. control etc ) instantly as we are driving, at all loads, at all throttle openings, at all revs, under real world conditions. Any changes that are made take effect and can be measured immediately ...no educated guesses, no estimates, no "close enough" assumptions.

This allows a more accurate, effective and truly custom map for each individual car. A dyno is not required for this, live road mapping is the ultimate way to configure a map on any car and it is how it is done on Rally, Formula 1, and all true race and very high end performance applications.

Dont get me wrong, dynos still have their uses of course in initial set up procedures and attaining power figures, but, especially for force inducted cars, final mapping should always be done live and on the road as a dyno is not as accurate as many would have you believe and, most importantly, can never replicate real world air flow, climatic and load conditions, all crucial factors.

Over the last two days we mapped the following cars in this manner :

- E36 m3 evo with CA CSL style carbon air box, including deletion of MAF and conversion to Alpha N
- E36 M3 evo with DA Motorsport ASA based superchager system. We did not fit this system,and it normally comes with a piggy back management system, but the owner called us at the end of his tether as the car just would not run right or even idle.In this case we refitted the MAF that DA had eliminated in it's kit as it suited the application better.
- The two "stage 4" M3 cars (our demo yellow car being one of them), having fitted larger injectors and some more minor engine mods.
- Bruntingthorpe owner David's E39 M5 and jaguar XJ220 ( + 60 bhp) . We did these for free as David has always been so helpful to CA :D

The customers were very happy indeed with the results, as were we with our demo car, it is even smoother and more ferocious , we may even have broken 540 bhp, we will post up dyno results when we get them :)

The only downside of live mapping is the hours it consumes, and the cost.

A typical charge for a live map, including track hire is £1800 plus vat, and we would only recommend the process where :

1. the car has been extensively modified and the tuner has not previously formulated a generic map for the conversion
2. a new or custom tuning kit / product has been fitted that has not previously been tried out or mapped for
3. the customer simply wants the very best possible regardless of cost

Anyway hope you find the images interesting and that we have not bored you too much. Again I stress that none of my comments on other software tuners refer to any one company in particular.

Images show, from left to right :
1. preparing ECU forconnection of emulator
2. our M3 's 3D fuel map
3. M3 's vanos map
4. David's XJ,
5. CA carbon airbox fitted to customer Steve's e36 m3 evo
6. the expensive emulator fitted to the above mentioned e36 m3's ecu
7. the DA motorsport supercharger kit fitted to another customer's e36 m3 evo

huzi7
23-06-2007, 03:15 PM
excellent write up Roy

cools pics as well

kpkpkp
23-06-2007, 03:25 PM
So is it worth you guys and Mr X Mclaren to make the ultimate map for a standard E46 - I am sure there will be a few of us that would be interested if the price was right and it was just a simple "plug in the lap top and up load" style upgrade.

Kp

CA Automotive UK
23-06-2007, 03:43 PM
To be honest no, this would not really be worth it for a standard M3 ...good standard "generic" maps that CA and many other tuners offer are fine for these applications, as they have already been developed on dyno and finished off "live".

For us to develop a live map on a standard M3 and us to then convert it for loading onto all versions of M3 would only offer marginal gains, would be damn expensive, and would no longer be a true custom live map for your particular car only.

You can have 10 different M3 cars all built to same spec in same year, and they will all be slightly different in performance and outputs, so each would require it's own live mapping session for the very best results.

To my mind live mapping is only for customers who want the very best and have,in a sense, money to burn, or for cars that have been tuned beyond the realms of merely intakes, race cats and exhausts etc .

kpkpkp
23-06-2007, 04:35 PM
Just a thought - whilst your here - a superprint x pipe without a resonator is what people call a rasp pipe - ie to make the rasp - raspier

sorry for the quick thread jack.

Anyway

Awesome write up and a great read as always

Kp

Chaos
23-06-2007, 04:45 PM
.....just a simple "plug in the lap top and up load" style upgrade.
That sentence alone defines it as the opposite, that's precisely what a live re-map isn't dude. Not knocking the idea, but as Roy's said they have a laptop-load map for the E46, so the answer to your question in it's best format is there already.

kpkpkp
23-06-2007, 04:49 PM
What I was actucally getting at was rather than a remap that has been developed on the rollers - in an non-real-world how about doing one live in a car for better results as Roy already stated most maps are done on a dyno.

Therfore a realworld map would give better results than one developed in a tuners with a fan in front the car.

Kp

CA Automotive UK
23-06-2007, 04:57 PM
I see what you mean, but most if not all good "normal" remaps have also been finalised using live mapping :)

Any gains we could get by doing our own live version the way you suggest would probbaly not be worth the extra money. You would probably have to figure on about £1000 for the remap to each car.

The thing to watch out for is the cheap maps ( "percentage" maps as many tuners call them) where the tuner cannot truly break into the code to adjust paramaters point by point and instead issues a general control byte into the ECU that simply adds, for example, 10 % more fuel and 5% more iginition advance throughout the whole rev range in in all conditons. Whilst this may well produce some gains somewhere and the car will certainly "feel" different, it is bodge and can be deleterious to engine reliability and life in the long run ( or short term even in some cases).

regards

mnathan
24-06-2007, 11:25 AM
Great write up Roy!

Truly informative.......

What are your thoughts on `chip tuning` for forced induction bmws - Do you tune your ASA S/C cars on the dyno usually or upload a `generic` type software for the vehicle? The reason i ask is because i initally uploaded software for my TS2 via the internet and an OBD interface but had to finally send the DME in for a better base-mapping .

Thanks

Max

k14krm
24-06-2007, 09:04 PM
roy,
once again brilliant write up.
i was fortunately invited up by roy to brunty on thursday.
all i can say guys is, roy really knows his sh*t when it comes to mapping.
i had come up in my new baby (after my s-class was jacked).

i ended up buying a E63 AMG and my cousin had come up in his E60 M5.

what a brilliant day. guys if you love your cars and money isnt a object to you, i would really consider getting a custom map rather than a generic map.
the work involved is overwhelming. its so precise and detailed it will baffle you! lol.
roy - i need those kleemann manifolds!!!!! then it has to be a live map.

abit of info on the M5 and E63

E63 - remapped and secondary cats removed. all work done by DMS.

M5 - hartge 21" wheels, hartge lowering springs, hartge front and rear lower spoilers also remappd.

took both cars out for a spin on brunty, these cars were neck and neck all the way upto 180-185!!!

also saw roys mad banana, what a beatiful machine.
also saw another one of roys customer crs (sorry but dont know his name)
another 525bhp monster!! this guy was a really good driver.

thanks again roy. ;)
just a few snaps of the day.

http://img102.imageshack.us/img102/4140/cimg0007uw1.th.jpg (http://img102.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg0007uw1.jpg)

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/6864/cimg0009rc0.th.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg0009rc0.jpg)

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/9143/cimg0013er7.th.jpg (http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg0013er7.jpg)

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/5615/cimg0014yd8.th.jpg (http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg0014yd8.jpg)


http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/5615/cimg0014yd8.th.jpg (http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg0014yd8.jpg)

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/359/cimg0026nj8.th.jpg (http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg0026nj8.jpg)

http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/8985/cimg0031pi7.th.jpg (http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=cimg0031pi7.jpg)

http://img459.imageshack.us/img459/4105/image351kk3.th.jpg (http://img459.imageshack.us/my.php?image=image351kk3.jpg)

CA Automotive UK
25-06-2007, 10:42 AM
THANKS FOR THE IMAGES KASS :)

Max, regards your ESS question, the map ESS provided you should be fine. For various reasons sometimes an e mailed file will not "take" to the ecu and the ecu has to be physically sent over to the tuner for reflashing. This is usually due to the equipment being used.

A live map will certainly improve you car for al the reasons outlined in my first post, but whether this is worth £1500...only you can answer that :)

all the best

SJD
25-06-2007, 01:41 PM
Roy - once again an informative and worthwhile write up. Thanks for taking the time out to detail the information for us.:)

CA Automotive UK
26-06-2007, 07:30 PM
One of the customers whose car we mapped e mailed me today :)

see screen print below

CA Automotive UK
26-06-2007, 07:31 PM
for some reason the text cannot be clkearly seen, here is a paste :

Hi Roy

Following the hours spent at Bruntingthorpe custom mapping our car, I would like to thank CA Automotive Technologies for the expertise they provided in custom mapping my supercharged E36 M3.

The engine managment has been set up perfectly to cope with track and road use; I was also able to test the car to the limit at the track. I reccomend CA Automotive Technologies for any such BMW work.


Many thanks

Ed Sayers

Mpower Newbury