330 Clubsport induction kit advice reqd

[Nickleback]

I have a std 330 clubsport used for business covering 20,000 miles pa. The car is 2 yrs old, has 29,000miles on the clock & is still under warranty.
I want to improve performance when I need it, improve ecomomy when I dont & keep reliability the same as std.
Is the best way to achieve this is an induction kit, if so, any recommendations ? [hmm

[330ciSport]

Not really. The induction kit will give you a far better engine tone under load, but in isolation will not give you the "improved performance" you are looking for.

Its unfortunate, but the only easy ways to see a noticable increase in power on a 330 petrol is to Supercharge or to buy an M3 :cool:

An entry level S/C kit will cost you about £4500, will deliver appx. 280bhp and a noticable increase in torque. But then, you'll be needing to think about uprated clutch, brakes and suspension.

The S/C option seems to be pretty reliable as long as you dont go bananas with the power, as I'm sure one of the many "blown" members will shortly comment on!

[peppernick]

330cisport is right, you will not expect any major performance gains with just an induction kit no matter what manufacturers claim. Think about it logically, the most important area is the inlet manifold, if that remains the same size no matter how you modify the induction system you will not get much improvements. Just like people claimimg an exhaust will give you X amount of HP but if you don't change the kats or the manifold (which are the most restricitve parts of an exhaust system), the rear box alone will not give you any significant gains.

OK some kit has been 'proved' to give a slight HP gain on dyno. But mostly at higher rpms. But if you have to rev to that level to achieve the extra few HP, inadvertently you will feel the car is faster because 1) it sounds more aggressive at 7000rpm and 2) you're already wringing out the engine; hence it's faster, not because of the induction kit.

For us who has changed induction kits many times, we can frankly tell you to get an induction system for the noise. Just like you you get an exhaust for the noise it makes.

Fuel economy can get worse, because you'll be driving harder, revving higher just to hear the induction roar. Not because the induction kit is there. If you drive gently or just cruise on a motorway, your fuel economy will not alter :)

Hope this helps and WELCOME [hiya

[Nickleback]

Thx for the welcome & the info guys, my trouble is that the car is used in connection with my sales job & therefore whilst I would love an M3, the cost of running it as a company car on 25k miles pa is too high.
What tweaks would you suggest without going to a full SC & uprating the clutch, suspension & brakes etc etc?
Being the newbie around here I can't see Teddy in the members list or know his forum name to get the details from him on the rear led's ?

[BigFas]

Teddy is known as MysticM3, he has a section on the forum called SSDD Motorsport, his web address is www.ssdd-motorsport.com and the thread re: LED's is here http://sankeys.demon.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=890

[peppernick]

I must say that in terms of performance tuning for an E46 330, unless you spend a bit, it'll be difficult to find HP gains that will allow you to really appreciate the difference, and realistically justify the outlay of minor performance mods, unless you're a modding nut :p

However, I can recommend a rear diff with shorter ratio to make the car accelerate better(most noticable performance mod), but in the expense of top speed, motorway low rev cruising and fuel economy.

Teddy is MysticM3 and this is his section ;)

http://sankeys.demon.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=4

His website (www.ssdd-motorsport.com)

[Nickleback]

Thx BigFas, as one of the principals - do you know if you have any other members with 330 clubsports ?????

[peppernick]

Thx BigFas, as one of the principals - do you know if you have any other members with 330 clubsports ?????
Ahhhhh my old car ;) ;) .......fire away questions :cool:

[BigFas]

330Singh has just bought a Clubsport and Nick is an ex-owner of one. No-one knows more about performance tuning a 330 Clubsport than our man Nick ;) I'll let him post pics of his old whip

[Nickleback]

At the risk of asking you to "walk down memory lane", have you got a list of the mods that you did to it that you really rated & that you would do again ?

[peppernick]

At the risk of asking you to "walk down memory lane", have you got a list of the mods that you did to it that you really rated & that you would do again ?

This was the list ;)


ASA SK+ supercharger
DiGi-Tec Engine Management
3.28 rear diff
Eisenmann Race exhaust + Hi-flow sound pipes
Genuine ACS Type 3 18X8.5 + Yokohama AVS Sport (235/40, 255/35)
FK Coilovers
Powerflex front control arm bushes + new control arms (5/04)
Rogue Engineering aluminium rear top shock mount
Rogue Engineering rear trailing arm bushes
Genuine AC Schnitzer Racing strut brace
Active Autowerk polished steel oil cap


Genuine carbon fibre interior trim
OEM CSL centre console
Custom built M3 steering wheel (3 colour stiching) with SSG paddles
SMG2 gear nob
OEM AC Schnitzer pedals and foot rest
OEM AC Schnitzer hand brake handle
Lockwood silver dials
X-Tec interior xenon look bulbs

OEM M3 side skirt
Colour coded front Clubsport splitter
OEM Hamann shadow grill
Wheelpower 8000k DDE angel eyes + remote activation
OEM BMW rear LED lights
Philips Ultinon 6000k xenon bulbs
OEM AC Schnitzer wing mirrors
Projector indicator lamps


2 things I would definitely do again if I had a 330 are Eisenmann full exhaust and the supercharger (although I would opt for a manual car and go full SK2 350BHP 400Nm torque). The Eisenmann exhaust with the centre pipes gave me such pleasure each time I hit the throttle. The noise alone was worth it. The supercharger totally transformed the car. So much more torque and turned the 330 into a true street sleeper. Durgesh's car has the SK2 and he scared quite a few M3 drivers when they expected to trash a 330 vert.

However, supercharging is a fine art and the installation is most important. Get a good install and you'll be laughing. A bad install and you'll weep tears. The best thing about ASA S/Cs is they are so simplistic and chances of things going wrong is relatively minimal if done right the first time. However, expect your MPG to be in the low 20s and trust me, you won't be taking it easily once you head down this route ;) Also, you will most likely loose your warranty once your car is out of the BMW UK 3yr programme.

The Eisenmann exhaust frees up a few top end ponies but it's the noise that you do it for. I would highly recommend you take a look at this. Eisenmann systems can be sought through Roy at www.ca-automotive.co.uk

OK, then it takes me to my 2nd question, is your car a manual or auto? ;)

[Nickleback]

Unfortunatly for me, it is an auto - had to be sensible for work as I spend alot of time on M25 & in london queuing !!

[peppernick]

OK :)

Don't spend money on re-map/chip etc as any power gains will very quickly be sapped up by the torque converter. If you want better driving acoustics, get an exhaust or induction (they both make very distinctive noises, also some lesser exhausts drone on motorway cruising which can be annoying where as induction kits don't). The GruppeM styled induction makes the best induction noise, no arguments. When it comes to exhausts, it's slightly more difficult as different people has different taste. The best way to find out which exhaust you like is to go to meets and listen for yourself (There's one hapening next Sunday (http://sankeys.demon.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=1104) )

Diff upgrade is also not as straight forward as a manual car as car computer these days are too clever, any change in ratio and the auto gearbox electronics will go on strike :mad: Fitting more aggressive camshafts will also give you slightly more top end power but unless you spend a lot of time around 5000-6000 RPM, the power gained is useless to you. Plus they are not cheap once you go down that route.

If you really want a more involving driving experience, I suggest THIS (http://www.bmw-paddleshift-retrofit.com/) Put in in full auto when you're lazy and when you want some fun, flick the paddles :cool:

In terms of performance mods, there's very little you can do to make it worthwhile unless you dish out for a S/C. Even still, you will have a much lower power ceiling as the auto box can only cope with 380Nm of torque before disintegrating. This is not exactly a bad thing as new BMWs come pretty well sorted from the factory :)

[Ali_]

Gosh Nick thats some intell, Dr Nick stricks again [read

Nickleback, welcome to the madhouse mate, as you can see there is a wealth of info to be found.. Re the CS 330, Nick's ride was the bomb and i think you would be hard pushed to find a better source of need to know...

If you can mate get down to the meet and say hi to the lads/ladies

[hiya

[Nickleback]

I guess this was what I probably suspected, that the trade off for work by having the auto meant that the car would have to stay fairly std engine performance wise, which means I'll probably start saving for an M3.
Thx for your honest upfront advice, I really appreciate you sharing the info & I'll try to get to the meet on Sunday.

[Nickleback]

Just got back from Teddy's listening to the great sound of my ---------------New SSDD Motorsport induction kit !!!
Thx to all for the recomendations.
PS: the second item is also now fitted - new rear LED's which also look cool from SSDD as well
Ah well, what's next ??

[Shuriken]

Welcome to the forum Nickleback. Although you may not be able to do the really big world-changing mods becuase your car is for work, there is a wealth of smaller, subtle mods that have been accomplished by people on here. Doing the smaller ones will probably not produce a measurable improvement, but it will make you feel better, it will be your own. :D

Look forward to seeing you at the meet. :)

Shuriken.

[Nickleback]

Hi,
Yeah but trying to be clean, subtle & original without the BHP is hard !!
Damm work - Oh well, maybe get promotion to M3 ---- Tee He

[Shuriken]

Yeah I meant other kinds of mods, like improving the appearance of it instead of performance. You could go 'show' instead of 'go'. :) Personal preference..

Shuriken.

[CA Automotive UK]

Welcome to the forum Nickleback !

Let me know if you are interested in the Eisenmann and ASA or Active autowerke Supercharging , as Nick says we are the official importers .

Follow Nicks advice and you just cant go wrong .......

I would respectfully correct one thing Nick said regarding remapping ....even if car is an auto , you will still gain the power benefits , its just they wont be as apparent on seat of the pants and dyno due to the t. converter ....but the power gains are still there . Also worth re mapping just to remove speed limiter and remove the flat spots that BMW purposefully engineer into the power curve to pass noise and emission regs .

best of luck with your mods

[CA Automotive UK]

.....and I am sure Nick will be along to correct me shortly :D

[Nickleback]

Thx 550 Nm,
To be really honest, I dont think @ this point I would go the S/C route as for 4-6k I would sell mine & get an M3 especially as the prices on an E46 are dropping it would appear.
The real question is:- what sensible mods to carry out for now whilst I wait & save ? [hmm

[mysticm3]

you had your induction kit now :) and you can also get other 'value-for-money' performance mods such as performance pulleys, fly wheels, rear diff, and a decent exhaust system. Remapping is also recommended but greater difference can be felt with a manual car of course.

[CA Automotive UK]

i agree with all teddy has just said .

you can also consider Schrick cams .....

[peppernick]

Roy, you have very good points regarding the flat spots and speed limit [ok

IMHO I would still say for the amount of money you are going to put on re-mapping an auto car, unless it's done to compliment other mods, I would personally choose an exhaust first. Get those mods that you can really enjoy, whet your appetite, then start working on finer details [cool

[Nickleback]

[cool info, few more cosmetics first whilst I contemplate mechanics - Grey cells overloaded !!
Appreciate the info & help [hmm

[westside]

well i have just fitted the gruppe m replica induction system supersprint back box and center box and the car sounds lovely its got a wicked rubble now. I am getting a re map done soona and gonna change the pullys to the UUC ones i am not expecting big gains but something is better then nothing lol with the above mod si hope to get around 10 12 bhp

[Lucky Bob]

I have a std 330 clubsport used for business covering 20,000 miles pa. The car is 2 yrs old, has 29,000miles on the clock & is still under warranty.
I want to improve performance when I need it, improve ecomomy when I dont & keep reliability the same as std.
Is the best way to achieve this is an induction kit, if so, any recommendations ? [hmm



Nickleback

I'm in the same boat as you, just got facelift 330ci sport manual, and it needs more power.

My car is going into AMD hopefully next week for a remap, milltek exhaust and some before and after time on the dyno.

AMD go into print with 28bhp / 17ft/ lbs torque, and you get detailed dyno plots when they have finished.

The finished results don't give you a massive power increase but a more flexible responsive drive with welcomed increase in power.

So when I get it back i'll post the results.

They also state that the standard induction system is fine upto 450bhp.

Obviously there are some excellent tuning companies on this board, I just picked AMD because they are local for me and have lots of press recommendations, and they tell you exactly what they are going to do without making any wild claims.

Cheers


LB

[CA Automotive UK]

AMD are an excellent company , and I am sure you will get a very good job done .

i would however dispute the fact that 330 airbox is good for 450 bhp ...just does not add up ....any opinions here Nick ?

[Lucky Bob]

Roy

I would no know if it was good for 450bhp or not, but yes it does seem like a really high figure.

Ps thats a hell of a lot of Torque on your sig

LB

[Nickleback]

Lucky Bob,
Sounds [cool I would be very interested in your feedback especially on the actual dyno results and how you think it drives.
Cant wait !!